First off, i'd like to say that i really hope that this thread doesn't fall under the "i'm 15 and the guy i've been dating for two weeks broke up with me"
cathegory mentioned in the sticky post. I like to thing that it doesn't, but then again, that may very well be the result of the fact that i'm obviously subjective when it comes to my own "problems". I'll let you be the judge of that, so I'll get started with the story.
The last October I signed up for a french language course at the local "French Institute", and i became part of a group. One of the people in this group was a young lady who I became attracted to. I'd lie if i told you that I wasn't physically attracted to her at first (I had never met her before), but soon came other things, fairly small things if you come to think of it, that made me...develop a crush, if you like, (I'm a little bit uneasy when it comes to using the phrase "to fall in love"...but I think you get the point), despite the fact that she is older me - she is 24, and I'm 18. We became buddies, exchanged phone numbers (just to keep in touch if we would ever have any troubles with the french course, we called it), etc.
I didn't want to be pushy, but i did want to talk to her, so i sent her a text message, and to my surprise, she replyied (her reply surprised me because I expected her to ignore me, or to reply very concisely), and she was very nice to me, we started talking on the phone, making jokes, the sort of stuff one could consider "flirting". But i soon found out that she had a boyfriend. That didn't stop me, however, and i could argue that she was leading me on. So i went ahead and told her that i liked her, and she took it very lightly at first, almost like a joke; she said she liked me too, but i insisted that i was serious, and that i "really" liked her. She didn't seem bothered by this fact, but she did tell me that i shouldn't have told her this, knowing that she was in a relationship. I dropped the whole thing, and we went back to joking around, messaging each other, etc. This went on for 7 months or something, during which i tried to give her "hints", you know, about the fact that i was serious when i had told her that i liked her, etc. And i was under the impression that she liked me too, she told me that i'm cute, she seemed interested in my ideas, in my topics, she thought i was funny, she even told me that "when she was my age", she would have really liked to have "met someone like me", and that she was surprised that I didn't have a girlfriend; but she never went "too far", if you know what i mean. It was like she was careful not to cross a certain line.
All went like this until a week ago, when I realised that the course was going to end soon, and it could be that I would never see her again. I told her this, and I asked her if i was ever going to see her again, but she avoided the answer. I insisted, and although she didn't tell me this literally, she implied that..."probably not". And that "that's life, deal with it". I said that i didn't WANT to deal with it, that i CAN'T just "deal" with it, and I asked her if she would even miss me. She said that she probably would, but I wouldn't be "realistic" if I were to want us to meet each other two times a week like we used to at the course. I (unfortunately) became very dramatic, and I asked her what was I to do, how could I "deal" with this, how could I just ignore my feelings, and you know what she had to say about this? "I wouldn't know, i like to stay away from impossible challenges". This, needless to say, made me very sad, probably due to my age, and the period i'm going through, I can't argue with that, but...I hope you believe me when I say that...my feelings were real, and I couldn't understand why, despite the fact that she seemed to like me, and having told me all that she had (she even called me her "sweet, funny, artist"), I all of the sudden found myself forced to "deal" with the fact that I was never going to see her again, and that the "challenge" I had chosen (as in...wanting to be with her, becoming attracted to her) was impossible. I told her that she was being mean, and that she was playing with my feelings, which lead to a fight, and her becoming mad at me, and not wanting to talk to me anymore. We've met once since this whole incident, and although she seemed determined not to talk to me, I could feel (as...corny as this may sound) that she didn't WANT things to stay like this. I tried to tell her that I'm sorry for the fight I started, but It didn't do any good...
The bottom line is that I am now really sad for a number of reasons. One would be the fact that I can't understand why, given the fact that she likes me, and that she seemed interested in me, we can't be together; the age thing? I like to think that I don't act like a little child, and that I can be treated like a young adult, why isn't that enough? Isn't the fact that we could talk, and that we could sustain an interesting conversation proof enough of my maturity? The fact that she has a boyfriend? If she's so in love with her boyfriend, why would she have acted like she did? Why would she have said all the things that she did?
I admit it. My "love-life" skills (in lack of a better word) aren't that great. I may very well have messed up by being too pushy, and by starting a fight, but...I was only expressing my feelings! Isn't the fact that I'm sincere, and that I'm willing to admit that I'm wrong, when I'm wrong, and that I'm willing to act as maturely as I possibly can, and that I'm willing to learn, to grow up, and the fact that all I want is to be near her...enough?
For those of you who had the patience to read all the way through, I thank you. If you feel like giving advice (i would apreciate it, however, if you didn't tell me to "get over it", or "find some other girl", or to "live my life, 'cause it's all ahead of me"), your thoughts are certainly welcome.
Thank you!

That's certainly a situation you've gotten yourself into.

My first thought is that she doesn't want to be with you because she's got a boyfriend. Maybe she is really happy with him and she's just a flirty kind of person. It wasn't right of her to lead you on and then put you down by saying that she was an impossible challenge for you.

I say go a couple of weeks without actively thinking about her. Don't pine after her, don't text her, don't try to remember funny things she's said. If you can go these two weeks without dying, and you can accept the fact that she was less than honest about her feelings, then I think you'll be fine. I'm going to type a cliche right now and believe me, I'm not really into cliches, but life does go on. I'm not trying to say that your feelings are baseless or just infatuation, but it would seem that the girl isn't going to give up her boyfriend and she's made it clear to you that she's not interested in a relationship (beyond friendship) with you.

I don't think your post is one of those "I'm 15 and the guy i've been dating for two weeks broke up with me" posts, and here's why. There is a far bigger issue at hand. You are confused because you misread somebody's signals, and that's an issue we can all have from time to time.

This girl obviously does not want to be with you, probably because she really likes her current boyfriend, who is probably closer to her age and maturity level. The maturity gap between 24 and 18 years old is quite large, but the gap between a 24-year-old female and an 18-year-old male is astronomical.

None of this is to say that she might not like to remain friends with you, but (as a girl in a committed relationship with male friends) I can tell you she's having several conflicts.

The first, and most obvious, is that she is afraid that if she maintains your friendship you will keep pushing her to leave her boyfriend and be with you. From the way you are talking, I have to say that I perceive you this way. That doesn't make you a bad person at all, but it is very hard for a girl to deal with a guy who won't take no for an answer, and often his friendship, however great, is just not worth the suffering of that.

She is probably also weighing how much time she can spend with you without ticking off her boyfriend. When you two were taking a class together, it was understandable she needed a study partner, but now it wouldn't be as understandable. This is not to say that her boyfriend is controlling, only that she has a vested interest in keeping him happy if she is enjoying the relationship, and a continued friendship with you (especially meeting once a week or more) would cause unnecessary tension in her relationship. She may also be approaching a time in her life when she'd like to settle down and get married, and she knows that she's better off doing that with someone closer to her own age. You can't blame her for that.

She is also, most likely, feeling guilty that you felt led on. Flirting might just be part of her character, and she knows by your reaction that you misinterpret how she interacts with you. She, being a decent human being, does not want to lead you on even further, because it would only cause heartache for you both. By the way, are you a "sweet, funny artist"? She was probably just saying things that you took to heart too much. Some girls are just over-friendly and flirty.

I know what you're going through is hard, but there are other girls in the world, ones that don't have boyfriends. I feel sorry for you, but at the same time I wonder what it is about you that would lead you to want to steal a girl away from her boyfriend, if she's happy with him. There are other fish in the sea, and if I were you I'd try to find one who isn't currently hooked.

As for getting over her, this is likely to be a painful process. I agree with the previous poster about how to deal with it. Try to put her out of your mind for a few days. Days will turn into weeks, weeks will turn into months, and eventually she'll fade.

I'm rooting for you.

<3 Mary

Thank you both for your replyies, first of all. I (think) I understood what both of you tried to tell me, and although it is hard for me to accept this, you are right. Of course, things like, "this isn't fair", "don't I have the right to be happy too", etc, etc, etc, come to mind... I guess I also hate myself for not being able to...be more than I am, so to speak. To be a better person. To be...more than an 18 year old boy. I know it doesn't do anyone any good, but I can't help thinking about the fact that maybe if I were older, things would be different...and this certainly makes me sad. But then again, you're also right about me being a jerk for trying to separate her from her boyfriend...but the truth is that I AM jealous, and I CAN'T help wondering what makes him better than me, what grants HIM the right to be happy... I'm only human, and I would be a liar if I told you that "I understand, and I can deal with the situation". But what I CAN do is try to not cause any more harm to anyone. I hope I'm not being too dramatic...
Thank you again for your time and interest!

You have to understand that the person has every reason to be upset with you... She has a boyfriend, you knew this, yet you persisted. You persisted to the point where you actually fought over something that doesn't exist.

For you to say you don't WANT to deal with it, nor CAN'T deal with it, and that you just want to continue seeing her is just being selfish. All about YOU YOU YOU. What YOU want. What about HER? What about what SHE wants?

She implied "that's life, deal with it"... I've got news for you... That's IS life, and the absolute truth and is a huge part of growing up. And I can guarantee that this won't be the first time you'll have to deal with things not going your way. Welcome to the real world. Suck it up, learn to deal with things and be patient. You'll find somebody.

Apart from the things i've already mentioned, which, as imature or selfish as they may be, are the truth, the fact that the last thing I did when I had the chance to talk to her was to cause a fight and cause her to become angry with me drives me crazy. If we're never going to see each other again, fine, I'm starting to grasp the concept that "that's life", but right now I would do anything to make up with her (I...hope that's how you call it...), and i would feel much better if she forgived me, and...kept a nice memory of me, I think...if you know what I mean. I don't want her to remember me as a jerk, that's basically it. But she won't even talk to me.
You know, I tried to avoid using "I want", "I don't want", etc, in this post, especially after what biff said, but...I guess i can't help it! I...mean no harm, though, hope you believe me...

it is OK to want certain things. But you also have to accept certain things.

In my honest opinion, you came off kind of creepy to me in terms of your feelings. You need to respect what she has decided.

She may have been uncomfortable with you telling her all this. I was feeling uncomfortable just reading it. I am 25, if some 18 yo did what you are doing, i would be freaked. perhaps having a huge fight with you was just the out she was looking for.

you need to face facts. she is gone. she is not in your class and is moving on with her boyfriend. she is not the only pretty/smart/nice girl out there. you need to stop thinking about what could have been if you were older, or if she didn;t have a BF, because you are not older and she does have BF whom she obviously loves very much.

Well, I hate to say it so bluntly, but you came off kind of creepy in the story. I just don't think you really know if she is happy or not with her boyfriend, and since you kept persisting, that makes it even more creepy, especially from where she stands. And I'm not so sure that she actually led you on, some people just flirt a lot, and she just sounded like she wanted to be your friend during the French coarse that you guys took. But, I am going to have to agree with her, that is life, and you're going to have to deal with the fact that she's not going to be in your life anymore. And like LadyJo said, she's not the only pretty/smart/nice girl out there.

I'm not sure what you mean by "freaked". Do you mean to say that I didn't have the right to do what I did, because of my age? As in...wanting what I wanted? I admit it, I didn't know when to quit, or better said I did not want to quit, but at no point did I...make threats, or treat her disrespectfully, or any other things which may be considered as "freaky". But then again, like I said, I don't really know what that means.

Thank you both for your replyies, first of all. I (think) I understood what both of you tried to tell me, and although it is hard for me to accept this, you are right. Of course, things like, "this isn't fair", "don't I have the right to be happy too", etc, etc, etc, come to mind... I guess I also hate myself for not being able to...be more than I am, so to speak. To be a better person. To be...more than an 18 year old boy. I know it doesn't do anyone any good, but I can't help thinking about the fact that maybe if I were older, things would be different...and this certainly makes me sad. But then again, you're also right about me being a jerk for trying to separate her from her boyfriend...but the truth is that I AM jealous, and I CAN'T help wondering what makes him better than me, what grants HIM the right to be happy... I'm only human, and I would be a liar if I told you that "I understand, and I can deal with the situation". But what I CAN do is try to not cause any more harm to anyone. I hope I'm not being too dramatic...
Thank you again for your time and interest!

You're coming down with a bad case of "one-itis"--this woman has become the world for you, and no one else matters, even though she has no romantic interest in you, right? The best thing you can do now, as difficult as it may be, is to stop initiating contact with her. I'm not saying ignore her completely, just don't make a special effort to be around her or talk to her for the remainder of the class. There's nothing wrong with having a female friend who has a boyfriend. But you can't pressure her to leave him for you--those efforts are always counterproductive. If a similar situation occurs again with someone else, just be comfortable being friends with her.

You have to learn to find happiness within yourself, and stop trying to justify your existence through others. There are no words I can say to make that happen--you have to find out for yourself. When you do, though, you will be a happier person and a better person to others.

I'm not sure what you mean by "freaked". Do you mean to say that I didn't have the right to do what I did, because of my age? As in...wanting what I wanted? I admit it, I didn't know when to quit, or better said I did not want to quit, but at no point did I...make threats, or treat her disrespectfully, or any other things which may be considered as "freaky". But then again, like I said, I don't really know what that means.

just because you didn't threaten her does not mean she did not feel somewhat threatened by you. You come off as being obsessed with her, and that can freak a girl out (freaked out and creeped out mean the same thing). Your age has nothing to do with it. the fact that she has a BF, whom she loves, and told you she loves, and you cannot accept that, that is what is freaky. The fact that she wants absolutely nothing to do with you, and has told you so, and you are still obsessing about her, that is creepy. You sound like you are 1 step away from stalking her.

Everyone in this thread is telling you the same thing, and you are still persisting. We get what you want, we are all telling you it is not going to happen. Whatever feelings you thought she had for she obviously did not. Maybe she is just a bitch who was using you to pass the class. You'll never know, so just move on.

I'm really sorry you feel this way, and I am sorry she does not return your feelings. No one wants to see someone in emotional hell. But, your fascination with her is not healthy, and you need to move on.

I respect the fact that you're older and more experienced, and I sincerely understand that you're right. I don't have to like it, but you are. I'm sorry if I sounded weird, I can see why I did...who knows, in the end, this could all just be a stupid ambition of mine. And you don't have to worry about me being a stalker either...I just have trouble dealing with failure, I guess...as for how this whole thing ended, yesterday she told me that she's not mad at me, because she "wouldn't have the right to be, as we don't have a relationship which implies this kind of feelings, but she does think that she didn't deserve the way I spoke to her". Pretty straight forward, i have to say...
Nothing more left to say, either, I guess... who knows, maybe we'll get over this eventually and manage to stay friends...I'd really like that, because she really is a nice person, and...believe it or not, she does make my life better. And if this is called "obsessing" about her, than fine. So I'm obsessing about her.

Anyhow, thanks again for taking the time to reply.

In my opinion, she may have been a little harsh. Possibly a little snobbish.
She could have been more sensitive to your feelings. And friends are friends, whether you have a class together or not. If she was a real friend, and worth your time, she would still be talking to you even though she doesn't want a relationship with you. I'm not gonna tell you to get over it, cause you can't make yourself get over anything. I WILL tell you what I have found helps me in times like these.
Give yourself a couple days and just be miserable and feel sorry for yourself. Cry if you have to, cause crying makes you feel better. And talk to your friends (the nice ones that will listen). Eventually you will get tired of being miserable, and you'll start to feel better. But keep in mind that you should only bitch and whine to VERY TRUSTED, TOLERANT friends. Some people tend to stop talking to you if you are sad and talk about the same stuff over and over again.
BTW, about the age thing...as long as it's legal, age is just a number.

P.S. I have been in some situations like this, sometimes on the other side of your situation. If you need someone to talk to, don't hesitate to PM me. Even if you just want to complain and stuff, or talk about something you didn't want to post on the board. It won't annoy me, I promise, and I'd like to help any way I can, cause you seem very sad.:)

I know I'm coming in a little late on this thread, but there are a couple more things that I think should be said, Alassiel. I know I'm risking our wise lady moderators calling me a totally clueless guy, but what the hey. Here goes.

I can't say I blame you about feeling the way you do, and I'm not sure that she loves her boyfriend from what you've said, though she may. Women stay with boyfriends for a lot of different reasons. You'd hope that in most cases it is love, but some are codependent, some just like the gifts and attention, some don't want to be on their own, some settle for someone they don't love because he's "good enough," and some fear for their lives because of an abusive relationship. In any of those cases, Alassiel, once a woman has said "no," you have to honor her. Forcing a relationship never works, and if the romantic relationship with your friend is meant to be, then some day it will. If it's not, then c'est la vie. And don't forget that even when you're in a relationship, when a woman says "no" to touching, kissing, sex, etc., you stop, apologize and talk to her about it. If you keep going, it's at best abuse and at worst rape.

When you do fall in love with someone that truly loves you back and your relationship stands the test of time (at least a couple of years), consider yourself very fortunate and work at keeping that relationship alive for the rest of your lives. It's worth it.

As late as your reply may have come, it's welcome none the less. :) "Sharing" my problems here has certainly helped me, not so much in that which regards "getting over" this whole issue, but more in terms of...a sort of enlightment, if you like. :) I'm sure you all know what I mean despite the shortcomings of my 2-classes-per-week-at-school grasp of the english language. Even though I'm certain that I would never have gotten to the point of becoming obsessed, or what some of you have reffered to as a "stalker" :), it is clear to me now that what I was doing was wrong all the same. This doesn't mean that what I was feeling wasn't real; I'm quite sure I wasn't faking anything. This whole ocassion, nevertheless...contributed to my realisation of the fact that feelings are best kept on a tight leash now and then, if you know what i mean. :)

As a sort of conclusion, I've spoken to the person since my last post and I apologised (quite a bit, actually :) ). She accepted my apologies, and acted like nothing had happened (I have to confess that I wasn't expecting this, after all that had been said - and I'm quite grateful). I like to think that we've managed to remain friends, and right now this feels right. :)

Thank you all again for your replies, your advice and your interest!

Hi Alassiel, good that you managed to make an agreement with her. I think you can go on being friends with her. She may agree to see you sometimes if you really stop trying to force a relationship when she's with another person. If she will break up with her boyfriend sometimes and you're still interested in her, you can tell about your feelings again then. But even in that situation, don't press her.

I agree with some other people here that there really is an important age and maturity difference. A relationship with such age difference isn't impossible but it's rare and may be difficult. She has more experience of life than you do and women are generally more mature, like it or not. Even me, being a 19-year old female, find many 18-year old boys childish.
You are honest in your feelings, that is a sign of maturity. But you have also acted immaturately by trying to force a girl who already has a boyfriend into a relationship. And then being very dramatic about your feelings of abandonment.
It's always wrong to try to break someone's relationship, even if that person seems interested in you. If she is interested enough, she would break up with her current partner. She hasn't and it seems that she won't do that for you.

It was also wrong of her to flirt with you. But she also made it clear that she didn't want a relationship. Now, see her as a friend if you can and want to. To get your heart ache smaller, focus on other things than the sorrow most of your time. Probably it will be over soon or if not, you will still be able to deal with it better.
I hope everything will be OK.

Hi Eleanor, your comment is also welcome. However, i must confess that there is one thing that bothers me. I feel there is a small clarification to be made; I didn't "force" anyone to do anything. I didn't threaten the person in my story; as a matter of fact, I've never even asked her to be my girlfriend, or to leave her boyfriend, or anything simillar. All I "complained" about, if this is the appropiate term, was the fact that, the way I saw things at least, she had made me develop certain feelings for her, by the way she had acted, and the things she said, and made me believe that we were in fact friends, as in more than just class mates, and then all of the sudden she said that..."oh well, it's too bad we'll never see each other again, but that's life, I'm sure you'll get over it. What did you expect, we were never trully friends, we don't have anything to do with each other". Those weren't her exact words, of course, and perhaps I'm wrong to speak in her name like this, but please believe me that this IS what she implied. THIS was my "problem", not the fact that she had a boyfriend, and after all, caring for someone and expressing your feelings doesn't necessarily have to have anything to do with "forcing a relationship", as you seem to like to call it. I felt that there were things I needed to tell her, and I did it. And all that I expected of her was to act the way she had shown that she feels.
Oh, and call me simple minded or anything simillar, but I really don't think that anyone should go by these "previously set rules" you speak of (and by that I mean your mentioning the fact that "this sort of relationships rarely work). If I had felt that things really were all that "impossible" (strictly regarding...moral compatibility, if you like), I'm quite sure that I wouldn't have developed the feelings I spoke of.

Thank you

I have been in this situations except it was more dramitic and I really didn't force the issue of being in a relationship. This is a delicate situation, I suggest you move on because she is not going to break away from her boyfriend, lets say she does and goes out with you, more then likely you will become a rebound. She might be a great girl but as the saying goes their are more fish in the sea or pond. Take this as a learning expirence.

..."oh well, it's too bad we'll never see each other again, but that's life, I'm sure you'll get over it. What did you expect, we were never trully friends, we don't have anything to do with each other". Those weren't her exact words, of course, and perhaps I'm wrong to speak in her name like this, but please believe me that this IS what she implied.

Does she want to be friends with you since you last talked to her? If she would say things like that, she doesn't sound like a very nice person. Are you sure she is worthy of YOUR friendship? Maybe you should think about that. I hope everything works out for you! :)

Hi Eleanor, your comment is also welcome. However, i must confess that there is one thing that bothers me. I feel there is a small clarification to be made; I didn't "force" anyone to do anything. I didn't threaten the person in my story; as a matter of fact, I've never even asked her to be my girlfriend, or to leave her boyfriend, or anything simillar. All I "complained" about, if this is the appropiate term, was the fact that, the way I saw things at least, she had made me develop certain feelings for her, by the way she had acted, and the things she said, and made me believe that we were in fact friends, as in more than just class mates, and then all of the sudden she said that..."oh well, it's too bad we'll never see each other again, but that's life, I'm sure you'll get over it. What did you expect, we were never trully friends, we don't have anything to do with each other". Those weren't her exact words, of course, and perhaps I'm wrong to speak in her name like this, but please believe me that this IS what she implied. THIS was my "problem", not the fact that she had a boyfriend, and after all, caring for someone and expressing your feelings doesn't necessarily have to have anything to do with "forcing a relationship", as you seem to like to call it. I felt that there were things I needed to tell her, and I did it. And all that I expected of her was to act the way she had shown that she feels.
Oh, and call me simple minded or anything simillar, but I really don't think that anyone should go by these "previously set rules" you speak of (and by that I mean your mentioning the fact that "this sort of relationships rarely work). If I had felt that things really were all that "impossible" (strictly regarding...moral compatibility, if you like), I'm quite sure that I wouldn't have developed the feelings I spoke of.

Thank you
I wasn't saying that you were being simple minded. I was just saying that you were being immature when you acted so dramatic when she said you wouldn't see each other again (that you can't deal with it, for instance). Your behaviour wasn't very mature although I can understand you being very upset.

You didn't make it very clear how much you talked to her about your feelings and your wish to go out with her, but I got the idea that you had been talking a lot about your feelings of being in love with her and said you'd like a relationship. If the other person isn't leaving her partner, you'd better not talk several times about you being in love with her or wanting to be with her. It's OK to say it once but that should be it. It can be awkward if you're in a happy relationship and a person you're not interested in keeps talking like that. That may feel like pressure and damage a friendship.

When I said relationships with such age difference rarely work, I was explaining what that girl probably had been thinking when she didn't want to be with you. Anyway, she talked to you things like "when I was in your age...", I think that makes it quite clear that she found the age difference important. And I also said that a relationship like that wouldn't be impossible if she were free. If she will be some day, you might try again then.

I understand if you are disappointed and sad. She flirted, was being a friend and then refused to see you again. She was probably thinking that there was no reason but she wasn't kind to you when she refused to see you again.

But anyway, if you have made up with her, that's a good thing. I hope you can be glad of that at least.