Just wondering what you all think.
Do you think having postnatal depression justifys killing your child/ren, like Andrea Yates?

I think it does exist, but nothing, to me, justifys killing your children. Just because you are depressed is no excuse to take your childs life.

Anyway, just curious as to what everyone else think. Have any of you suffered from postnatal depression? If so, how did you deal with it?

Postnatal (also known as postpartum) depression is just depression, except it occurs in women after having a baby (usually only lasting a few weeks to a few months). It's as real as any other depression is.

I don't believe depression causes people to murder others. I have depression, and I'm not out killing other people. I do love how people (insane or not insane) use such factors as depression as an excuse, though.

There are few factors that come to my mind when killing any person can be "justified". Having any type of mental illness or psychosis is not one of them.

Just wondering what you all think.
Do you think having postnatal depression justifys killing your child/ren, like Andrea Yates?

I think it does exist, but nothing, to me, justifys killing your children. Just because you are depressed is no excuse to take your childs life.

Anyway, just curious as to what everyone else think. Have any of you suffered from postnatal depression? If so, how did you deal with it?
It does exits, I know for a fact that my mom suffered from it and me and my big sis are still both alive to witness it. I know mom's been depressed all her life and it does affect the kids, we're both pretty messed up in our own ways. But I don't blame her or anything, I know she's suffered a lot and it's not like you could choose whether or not you're depressed. And I have to say, I think I'm gonna be the one to break the cycle, I'm the first one, from all the way from my granny to my sis, to just sort of speak out about the shit I'm going through.

But anyways, nothing ever justifies murder, and especially nothing justifies killing your own child! Ever! Children are born innocent, what have they ever done if they're like a year old?

I talked about this in my thread about why would you commit murder and the only reason why I might was if somebody would rape or otherwise hurt my child. It's not justified either but that would be a situation where I'd no longer care about anything else but making the person who dared touch my kid suffer.

Just wondering what you all think.
Do you think having postnatal depression justifys killing your child/ren, like Andrea Yates?


Does any form of depression or mental disorder "justify" murder?

Seeing none of you think postnatal depression justifys the killing of your child, why do think the women who do kill their children get off lightly? Im mean, going to a mental hospital for a few years, big deal. They should go to jail like all the other murderers, and serve time. They should be charged with murder, and shouldn't be allowed to plead not guilty for reason of mental impairment, or insanity, It's just an easy way to escape the full penalty.

Seeing none of you think postnatal depression justifys the killing of your child, why do think the women who do kill their children get off lightly? Im mean, going to a mental hospital for a few years, big deal. They should go to jail like all the other murderers, and serve time. They should be charged with murder, and shouldn't be allowed to plead not guilty for reason of mental impairment, or insanity, It's just an easy way to escape the full penalty.
Wouldn't you describe Depression as a mental impairment? I sure as hell would.

Depression can never be used as an excuse for murder, but surely it can be offered in mitigation of sentence?

Just wondering what you all think.
Do you think having postnatal depression justifys killing your child/ren, like Andrea Yates?

I think it does exist, but nothing, to me, justifys killing your children. Just because you are depressed is no excuse to take your childs life.

Anyway, just curious as to what everyone else think. Have any of you suffered from postnatal depression? If so, how did you deal with it?
Of course PPD exists. Changing hormones in the mother after birth or stress from taking care of the baby often cause a mother to enter into a deep depression.

While I don't think that anything justifies killing your own child (or anybody else, for that matter), I do think that Postpartum Depression is a legal insanity defense. We wouldn't send a mentally retarded person to prison for murder, and we wouldn't send a schizophrenic to prison for it, either. So why would we send a depressed person? These people are still "Not Guilty by Reason of Mental Disease or Defect," right?

<3 Mary

Seeing none of you think postnatal depression justifys the killing of your child, why do think the women who do kill their children get off lightly? Im mean, going to a mental hospital for a few years, big deal. They should go to jail like all the other murderers, and serve time. They should be charged with murder, and shouldn't be allowed to plead not guilty for reason of mental impairment, or insanity, It's just an easy way to escape the full penalty.
Well, healthy people don't go around killing their kids, I think the moms who do something like that need help, no matter what they've done. They shouldn't just be let out, they need to get some treatment and not just some but a lot. I don't really think they understand what they're doing and in the end, the biggest punishment of all probably is getting better and truly understanding what you did...

why do think the women who do kill their children get off lightly? Im mean, going to a mental hospital for a few years, big deal. They should go to jail like all the other murderers, and serve time. Ever been in a mental hospital? Try it sometime and tell me which is better. Besides I don't think that's the point. Putting a mentally ill person in jail is just pointless. Do you think a depressed person really sees the difference? Might make you feel better but really doesn't serve any useful purpose.

edit: BTW it's a myth that a lot of criminals just plead insanity and get off. It rarely is a viable defense. The burden of demonstrating "not guilty by reason of mental defect" is actually pretty high. Just saying you had a bad day won't cut it. Even saying you've had a history mental illness rarely cuts it. So yeah, most of them go to jail anyway if that makes you feel better.

I talked about this in my thread about why would you commit murder and the only reason why I might was if somebody would rape or otherwise hurt my child.
How does that make it "murder"?

I wouldn't say it does. I have problems in "that area", but I haven't murdered anyone-and I don't plan on it. In fact, I think the fact that I'm "depressed" actually means that I want to get closer to people. A condition justifies nothing.

While I don't think that anything justifies killing your own child (or anybody else, for that matter), I do think that Postpartum Depression is a legal insanity defense.


So when exactly does the "postpartum" period end. I don't believe that a mother with a five year old child can really claim that they are in a postpartum depression.

So when exactly does the "postpartum" period end. I don't believe that a mother with a five year old child can really claim that they are in a postpartum depression.

Good question. I think it's only supposed to last six months or so? Obviously, it varies on when their hormones get back to normal.

And it's not always just depression. When it's really severe, like Andrea Yeats, it's called postpartum psychosis.

I wouldn't say it does. I have problems in "that area", but I haven't murdered anyone-and I don't plan on it. In fact, I think the fact that I'm "depressed" actually means that I want to get closer to people. A condition justifies nothing.
You're 13 years old... and yet you've had problems with post-natal depression?

Do you come from Liverpool?

:p

Head, that's three thousand posts, have a cookie. It's one of my Stoney McPothead cookies. You'll like it... :eek:

And I'm suprised that you all are debating its existence... my mother claims to be still suffering from it twenty years later ;).

I'm suprised that you all are debating its existence... my mother claims to be still suffering from it twenty years later ;).
I hope that's true of My Mother... There can be no other explanation for Linedancing... :confused:

Do you come from Liverpool?

:p

...except for the boy in the belfry, he's crazy, he's throwing himself down from the top of the tower. Like a hunchback in heaven he's ringing the bells in the church for the last half-an-hour. He's probably missing something or someone that he knows he can't have now.

And if he isn't I certainly am.


No?

And if he isn't I certainly am. Homesick for a clock that told the same time; sometimes you made no sense to me. If you lie on the ground in somebody's arms, you'll probably swallow some of their history.

Thank you, Suzanne Vega.

But as Marika stated, there are different levels of postpartum depression. At the mildest end, there's the "baby blues", which isn't really considered a disordered since it's estimated that up to 80% of mothers experience it. Then it moves on to depression/anxiety, obsessivie-compulsive disorder, panic disorder, and psychosis. While psychosis only occurs in about .1% of mothers, it has a 5% suicide rate and a 4% infanticide rate for those who have it. It can cause hallucinations, delusional thinking, delirium, and mania. Anti-psychotic medication can help, but only if it's diagnosed.

Wouldn't you describe Depression as a mental impairment? I sure as hell would.

Depression can never be used as an excuse for murder, but surely it can be offered in mitigation of sentence?
its known as a "mental disability" , and sometimes it does effect a courtcase , but not often if the person is "stable" , i hope thas how you spell it . :rolleyes:

My mom and older sister suffer from depression and they haven't murdered anyone.

My mom suffered from postnatal depression after my younger sister was born , she got it pretty bad , and its affected her for years. It messed up her whole life pretty much at the start and it sometimes leads into a longterm depression . So sometimes you can say you've got it for years. But you can't blame it for a murder.

Okay, maybe I was a little ignorant when I wrote that mothers who suffer post partum depression should not be allowed to plead insanity. I was wrong when I said that, but that still doesn't mean I agree with it. Going to a mental hospital for a few years won't change anything, it won't bring the baby back, and it probably won't cure her.

I have spent time in a mental hospital, to the person who asked. I have done a few things I am not proud of, and that was the result of it. I am happy to say that this was a number of years ago now, and I am alot better.

Okay, maybe I was a little ignorant when I wrote that mothers who suffer post partum depression should not be allowed to plead insanity. I was wrong when I said that, but that still doesn't mean I agree with it. Going to a mental hospital for a few years won't change anything, it won't bring the baby back, and it probably won't cure her.

I have spent time in a mental hospital, to the person who asked. I have done a few things I am not proud of, and that was the result of it. I am happy to say that this was a number of years ago now, and I am alot better.
I don't know what you did, but you didn't kill anybody, right? People who go to those, um, what are they, well some psychiatric prisons, I think the treatment and rules and everything are a whole lot different. I think a woman who killed her child should end up in a place like that, not just some "regular" mental institution. As it happens, I've spent six months in one of those as well and I wouldn't think they completely "cure" you, but this isn't a discussion about the effectiveness of mental institutions, I just think that a mom who killed her kid will need treatment for many many years, like ten or twenty. If she's just thrown into jail, she'll never get better, she'll never truly understand what she did.

I can understand that, but women who kill their kids because they depressed often don't go to these hospitals for twenty or more years...

How many years did Andrea Yates get, anyone know? Is she in jail, or a hospital???

How many years did Andrea Yates get, anyone know? Is she in jail, or a hospital???

She's serving a life sentence in prison, eligible for parole after 40 years.

I have spent time in a mental hospital, to the person who asked. I have done a few things I am not proud of, and that was the result of it. I am happy to say that this was a number of years ago now, and I am alot better.That would be me. I should learn to think before I type. Many times people say things about mental illness out of ignorance. You obvioulsy know wherewith you speak and I apologize. And more importantly I'm glad to hear your doing better.

Don't feel bad, it's quite okay!

Well, I am glad that Andrea is serving out a decent punishment, and I do hope she is getting the help she needs for her illness. I also hope her husband can move on from the tragedy, which would be very hard to do.